Extra guide roller for BRe on CLH trailer

[PaulM]

My BRe bow used to grate up the swinging cradle as the guide rollers could not at first support the narrow front of the bows and left black rubber marks on them.  I bolted on an additional roller to the swinging cradle at the central lowest point.  This eases the bow upwards on recovery until the original cradle rollers can take over.  This, together with moving the rear rollers a few millimetres to one side has meant that the boat now aligns easily and well on the trailer.  The photo shows the roller in use.

[MarkF]

Paul,  we also seem to collect rubber marks from our rear rollers, so your idea looks very interesting.  Given the extra height, does the bow still rise up easily onto the swinging cradle?

Presumably you removed the rubber pads from the frame first?

[PaulM]

Hello Mark
Originally the first contact of my BRe with the trailer was the stainless steel bow strip rubbing up the swinging cradle galvanised steel beam whilst the cradle rollers tried to grip the bow on each side but couldn't because they could not hinge sufficiently, causing the rollers to jam and the bow to skid over the stationary rollers wearing them severely and leaving black marks on each side of the bow.
I fitted a roller to the cradle using two U bolts to avoid drilling.  Hopefully this is clear in the photo.  As the boat comes in to the cradle it first lifts up onto the new roller whilst being roughly lined up by the existing cradle rollers which then take over the lift completely.  By then the boat is high enough due to the new roller that the existing rollers can hinge sufficiently to take control and line the boat up nicely.  The new roller is then left behind lower and away from the hull as the boat continues forward onto the trailer.
The roller needs to be fairly wide and with a narrower diameter in the middle to help the bows self-centre if the boat comes in at an angle.    I have attached a second photo.
I also oil the rollers and winch a couple of times a year.
I am unsure what rubber pads and frame you are referring to?

[MarkF]

Thanks, Paul. Makes sense.
Our rear rollers also grip the boat too low down, so I'm going to try to implement your idea.

Where did you buy the roller and u-brackets from, please?

And do you oil the rollers with standard 3in1, rather than greasing them?

Our trailer has a pad on the swinging cradle, exactly where you say your keel band strikes it. Hope you can see in the pic.  I assumed all the trailers had one, but there seems to be no standard build!

[PaulM]

Hello Mark
I bought the roller and U bolts from Trailertek in September 2018.
(Parts in 2018 were U Bolt and clamp assembly 50x76 + 30mm, Sku: RLR126, Qty: 2, 8" V roller set, Sku: RK306, Qty: 1.)
I have tried spray Lithium grease, spray lanolin grease and WD40.  In future I may just use WD40 as it seems just as good as the spray greases.  Others may have a better suggestion?
Incidentally, at the risk of crossing the threads, I raised my front centreline roller early on to put it in contact with the keel.  The side front rollers are very lightly loaded (you can just about rotate them when the boat is on them) and all the weight seems to be on the centre line and swinging cradle rollers, which I would have guessed was about right.

[MarkF]

Ah ha! Their SKU numbers haven't changed in the fast-paced world of bits-for-trailers. I'll order them and let you know how I get on. Many thanks for your help.

I guess WD 40 doesn't collect dirt like a grease might. But I'd have thought lithium grease could protect against water for longer.

And yes, I eventually replaced our trailer bow roller with a higher one, so it sounds like our setup is simulated to yours - majority of the weight on the keel. It trails more happily now.

[PaulM]

Hello Mark
As there may be other differences beside the absence of a rubber pad it might be worth checking the cross section size of the cross beam before parting with your money for the U bolts.  When next at my boat I can measure mine for comparison if you wish.
I have used the roller since 2018 and been very pleased with it.  The only problem I have had is once I managed to get the winch strap trapped at the end of the roller and nearly got my feet wet pulling it out.  Wet feet is not a permitted part of recovering a Bayraider!

[PaulM]

Been to boat today.  Cross beam is a good 2in wide and just under 3in deep.  Two fresh photos may be attached.
Cheers Paul.

[MarkF]

Excellent pics. Is your new roller slightly deformed once you bolted it, because the square beam is also curved?

I've ordered the bits, but have an unexpected problem.  I assumed the pads we have in the middle of the swing arm were bolted on. It looks like they are riveted, with some fairly industrial pop rivets!

Trying to decide how to remove them - the usual drill-or-hammer option. It may work putting the roller on top, but it makes the whole assembly quite high.

[PaulM]

Yes, the new photos reminded me of the beam curve. I think that there was sufficient slop in the roller's fit to accommodate it, or if not the washers might need changing for thinner ones, a spacer introduced between the centre of the roller support and beam,  or the roller bracket "persuaded" to a slightly different shape.
The force on the roller at first is forwards as the boat climbs steeply upwards so I think it needs to be solidly mounted on the cross beam, which would be impeded by leaving the rubber pad.  I would also be wary about raising the roller as it will change the geometry.  So good luck with the rivets.  Or is it feasible to remove the rubber and leave the backing??

PS. Incidentally I couldn't help noticing tell tale black rubber marks on some beautiful BayCruiser 23s parked near my even more beautiful  BRe, and a (useless?) rubber pad on the top surface of a CLH trailer rather like yours.....But life would be more boring without CLH.

[MarkF]

I think the rubber pad is not entirely useless, as it does stop the stainless keel band striking the trailer frame, mentioned in various posts.  However, maybe as a result of re-jigging the geometry of the rollers on more recent traliers, our boats are gripped by them and need to rise higher more quickly.  I was wondering if just moving the rollers apart would do the trick, but suspect that won't be enough.

'Life would be more boring without CLH'   I think you have just hit upon a perfect strap-line for their company marketing!

[MarkF]

I've finally got round to fitting the roller to the middle of the swinging cradle. In case anyone else decides to do this and is first faced with removing the thick rubber pad, this maybe helpful:

The pad (see earlier photo on this thread) is riveted on with 4 heft rivets, approx 6mm diameter.

I tried drilling out the top, but the rivet heads are too hard. Plan-B involved hacksawing vertically through the rubber pad either side of the rivets and levering it off (it's not glued). This worked fine, leaving 4 rivet stubs to cut down. It's hard not to nick the galvanising with the saw, so take care.

Bolting on the aforementioned roller was simple. The roller frame does deform to the curve of the swinging cradle. On my installation, this bent it sufficiently that the roller pressed on the frame and was restricted.

By sawing off a shim from the removed rubber pad, this deformation can be avoided. Max shim thickness about 2mm. Mine is slightly too thick, so the photo shows the roller frame a little higher in the middle. Annoying , but not a functional issue.

Alternatively, spacing the u-bolts a bit further apart may have reduced initial deformation.